Printing troubles

A lost wax capable resin tuned for 30 - 50 micron slice thickness
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mikej
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Printing troubles

Post#61 » Thu Oct 09, 2014 1:38 am

you-b, I've seen this type of failure before when the z axis sticks near the lower limit.
What happens is it sticks in a very narrow range when lowering.
So it starts off fine, hits that "sticky height" and during the up/over/down overlift cycle it fails to come back down all the way. So the new layer can't stick to the last (it's still too high) and so every layer after becomes a "floater".

To test for this, go through the "Test Printer Functions..." calibration until you get to the step where you check the toggle switches. Use the up/down toggle to move to the lower limit. (Hold it down, the arm will stop automatically when it get's to that limit). Then move the arm up/down in small increments (using the toggle) near that lower limit. If you hear any "clicking" noise or the arm doesn't move, then it's sticking.
At that point, try loosening the 4 Phillips head screws that hold the black anti-backlash nut to the gold arm, don't take them out but back them off about 1/16" and try the up/down again. If that clears it, then retighten them but be careful not to over torque and use a cross pattern to gradually increase the torque on all 4 so as not push the nut one direction or another during tightening. Test again to make sure it's still not sticking near that lower limit.
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ROSITAGIOIELLI
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Printing troubles

Post#62 » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:22 pm

Hy Robert could you give us the settings copy log parameters of your nice 1.1 pendant? or where do I could find the 1:1 Mike default parameters mentioned above? You wrote:" Thanks Mike for the default 1:1 mix." where are them?
Thanks sergio

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Robert Howle
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Printing troubles

Post#63 » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:56 pm

That was an error. My mistake, When I installed the new 1.7.3 software and the 1:1 settings were in my "materials catalogue" I thought Mike had added it. He did not, the one I had in my catalogue was just not overwritten by the upgrade. The settings were actually mine. I will get those for the 1.1 machine at 31.75 z and 50 xy if u would like to try them. I do not have settings for any other slice thickness or xy setting.

Robert
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Printing troubles

Post#64 » Fri Oct 10, 2014 5:16 am

form: can you send me the stl file for testing? thanks!

mikej: hopefully you are right. I recently installed new bearings and may have tightened the screws a bit too much. I just loosened it a bit right now and am getting ready to try printing again.

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Printing troubles

Post#65 » Fri Oct 10, 2014 6:54 pm

I checked the up/down toggle switch as suggested by mikej. It did not stick, but did make a slight clicking sound. Loosened the screws a bit and now there's no longer any sound. Tried printing, but this time none of the layers stuck to the build table. I aborted the print, then tried to print something else. Unfortunately, same problem.

Below are the settings I used for 1:1 mix (Rob's settings):
Software Version: Version 1.7.3 Copyright 2014 B9Creations, LLC www.b9creator.com

Last Comm Port: COM3
Display Index: 1
Last Print Attempt Status: Aborted
Configuration: B9Creator v1.1.0, XY at 50 microns
Job Name: F:/to print/circle flower pendant updated.b9j
Job Data
Name: circle flower pendant updated
Description: date 10.10.14
XY Pixel Size: 50 µm
Slice Thickness: 31.75 µm
Total Layers: 336
Material Volume: 0.43 ml

Material Settings
ID: 1:1 Mix (Rob), Description: Hi-Res, lost wax suitable.
Calc Base: 8.59, Used Base: 7.856
Calc Over: 0.43, Used Over: 1.443
Calc Attach Layers: 2, Used Attach Layers: 2
Calc ABase: 34.36, Used ABase: 35.424
Calc AOver: 1.72, Used AOver: 1.772

Cycle Settings
Unsupported Pixel Multiplier: 1
Shutter Open Speed : 90
Shutter Close Speed : 90
Pre Exposure Delay (Settle) : 4
Post Exposure Delay (Kick) : 1
Post Release Delay (Breathe) : 1
Overlift Cutoff (mm) : 2
Initial Overlift (mm) : 1.6
Subsequent Overlift (mm) : 1.6
Dip (mm) : 0

Job Position
X Offset: 0
Y Offset: 0
Mirrored: false
Show Grid: true



I also changed the MSM to 1.1, since my prints before were coming out a bit thin. I'm going to try printing again tomorrow, but this time use the old acrylic VAT. I don't see why the VAT would make a difference, but I'm just going to try it since I'm not sure on what else to change to make it right. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated.

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Robert Howle
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Printing troubles

Post#66 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:26 am

Send me your file and let's look at it if it's a new file not printed before. Are u printing a file that u printed successfully before?

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mikej
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Post#67 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 3:15 am

If it was making a "slight clicking sound" it probably was sticking. If you corrected that, you'll probably still need to do another table calibration. Of course, anytime you change the vat, you must re-calibrate the build table.

Anytime the first layer fails to stick to the table (but still cures and is "floating) then the problem must be that when the build table lowered down if failed to squeeze out all the excess resin thus leaving a trapped amount too thick to allow for curing to the table. The way to fix this is make sure the table calibration is good, and maybe use the technique of "helping" the table squeeze out that extra resin on that first layer by pressing down firmly on the gold arm right before the exposure for the first layer begins.
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Printing troubles

Post#68 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:03 am

Earlier today I tried printing and holding down the gold arm for the first layer like mikej suggested. The foundation layers did stick to the build table. After walking away and coming back to check on it, I saw some layers floating in the VAT! I paused the print and was seeing what possibly could have gone wrong, but didn't see anything.
I tried another print and was watching it carefully this time. What I noticed was the arm moving the VAT gets stuck while printing some layers. It would only move half way, therefore it was projecting the image in a different spot and not on top of the previous layer. I stopped to print and played with the toggle switch moving the VAT and it was just not moving smoothly at all.
I took out the screw holding the arm to the moving bottom of the VAT and it was spinning fine. Placed back the screw, now it's not moving so smoothly, jams up sometimes. Next I tried removing the VAT, and it moves smoothly. I was looking for anything that may have gotten stuck that may hinder it moving smoothly, but didn't see anything. I wiped down everything and put the VAT back in place, now am in the process of a print. So far, seems to be going ok (knock of wood!).

My question is, what would cause it to jam up and not move smoothly like that? The only thing I can think of is dried up resin or dirt, which I did not see.

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Printing troubles

Post#69 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 12:34 pm

You-b,
I am currently having the same issue, with the x-axis movement getting stuck and the vat getting displaced during exposure. What did help me (so far) is making sure that the set screw that fastens the x-axis motor to the rotating arm is not loose (tricky to access that little sucker).. It seems to loosen up after some time.. Is everyone tightening that screw up once in a while or just me?

Besides that, a restart of your machine after an aborted print sometimes fixes any x-axis disturbances most of the time. Those are usually my first steps for troubleshooting.. so far that's all I had to check to get the x-axis running smoothly again..

Oh! I did ease the edges with some sanding paper of that plate in between the tracks on to which you mount the vat.. and also lubed the tracks..

Hope any of this is helpful.

V

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Robert Howle
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Post#70 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 4:00 pm

Discoverd another little tell tale sound today that will let u know that the table calibration is prob not going to be good.

When u get to the step to lower the build table to make contact with the PDMS (all four screws loose). Watch and listen carefully, make sure u are at the machine and not your desk. If u hear a clicking sound at the bottom just before the Z arm stops moving down, then your build table is not "floating" on the black arm.. Loosen the screws more and do again. I had this issue with a machine I am debugging for one of my clients. I had to bend (very slightly the red arms in, not out, this will make it even tighter on the black holder) in order to get the table to not bind when trying ot slide in the vertical screw slots on the black holder. Once I did this the clicking went away. Test printing now, all is well. Also his machne was not planar so there was an issue with binding of the Z screw. Also fixed.

Robert
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mikej
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Post#71 » Sun Oct 12, 2014 1:48 am

@you-be On the bottom of the x-axis motor there is a magnet that spins as the motor runs. Next to that magnet is hall sensor (small black plastic tab) which should be very close to rubbing on the magnet. If the gap between the tab and the magnet is too large it can fail to sense the rotation of the motor reliably and possibly cause the issue you are describing. Check the tab and see if you can gently push it a bit towards the magnet if the gap seems much more than 1/16" or so.
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Printing troubles

Post#72 » Sun Oct 12, 2014 7:21 pm

After I checked on the x axis motor, I tried printing. The print worked, but the model came out thinner that it was supposed to be. This is after I changed the Machine Specific Multiplier to 1.1. I tried another quick print of just prongs and changed Machine Specific Multiplier to 1.2. Still did not print to size. Should I increase it more? Or is there something else I should try changing?

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Robert Howle
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Post#73 » Sun Oct 12, 2014 9:17 pm

If u are printing with the 1:1 mix I would raise exposure "Base" and "Over" on subsequent layers to 10 sec and 2.5 sec. This is what I was using before the new 1.7.3. If u get "chubby" prongs or areas that are too thick then reduce 1 sec on base and 1/2 sec on over. Let me know how this works. Set the MSM back to 1.000 before u do this. Pictures of the model would help.

Robert
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mikej
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Printing troubles

Post#74 » Mon Oct 13, 2014 1:47 am

Please explain "thinner"? Is the print smaller in the xy (image) plane, or shorter in the z (height) plane, etc.
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Post#75 » Mon Oct 13, 2014 7:46 am

mikej: for example, I printed out a ring with the shank width at 2.10mm and the shank thickness/height at 1.10mm. The print results came out .2 smaller (width = 1.90mm and thickness = .90mm). I'm running another print right with the Machine Specific Multiplier at 1.3

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Robert Howle
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Post#76 » Mon Oct 13, 2014 9:53 am

Post the print data. Go to "Help" at top of the open App and select "copy last print settings to clipboard" and post.
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Post#77 » Tue Oct 14, 2014 6:50 am

I tried printing again yesterday with an increased machine specific multiplier of 1.3, and the prints still came out .2mm smaller/thinner. Below are the print settings:

Software Version: Version 1.7.3 Copyright 2014 B9Creations, LLC www.b9creator.com

Last Comm Port: COM3
Display Index: 1
Last Print Attempt Status: Completed
Configuration: B9Creator v1.1.0, XY at 50 microns

XY Pixel Size: 50 µm
Slice Thickness: 31.75 µm
Total Layers: 934
Material Volume: 0.88 ml

Material Settings
ID: 1:1 Mix (Rob), Description: Hi-Res, lost wax suitable.
Calc Base: 11.197, Used Base: 7.856
Calc Over: 0.56, Used Over: 1.443
Calc Attach Layers: 2, Used Attach Layers: 2
Calc ABase: 44.788, Used ABase: 35.424
Calc AOver: 2.24, Used AOver: 1.772

Cycle Settings
Unsupported Pixel Multiplier: 1
Shutter Open Speed : 85
Shutter Close Speed : 85
Pre Exposure Delay (Settle) : 4
Post Exposure Delay (Kick) : 1
Post Release Delay (Breathe) : 1
Overlift Cutoff (mm) : 2
Initial Overlift (mm) : 1.6
Subsequent Overlift (mm) : 1.6
Dip (mm) : 0

Job Position
X Offset: 0
Y Offset: 0
Mirrored: false
Show Grid: true

It is consistently coming out .2mm smaller/thinner, so there must be an adjustment to fix this. Just don't know what adjustments to make yet. Any advice is appreciated!

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Metalcaster
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Printing troubles

Post#78 » Tue Oct 14, 2014 9:45 am

Have you tried printing the full base with nothing on it ... or just a small part... but print the full base at 50 um x .5 thick
then measure the dimensions of the base and compare that to the actual dimensions you are supposed to have. The base measurements can vary by quite a bit and still print a nice piece... the part could be bigger or smaller due to the calibration...
I have been adjusting my machine (1.2) as my parts were coming out nice, but not accurate. Everything was in perfect focus... but, I found, that you could raise or lower the projector and still be able to focus perfectly almost anywhere... The result I had was a smaller base after printing because it was focused at below 50 um . Parts came out smaller. When I started this, My parts were coming out bigger then anticipated, so I know that I am near perfect as far as the calibration of the projector.... If I am wrong about this... someone please let me know. It seems to be working. After doing this, then doing the adjustments that Robert is talking about should work for tweaking.

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Printing troubles

Post#79 » Wed Oct 15, 2014 7:56 am

Metalcaster: In making your adjustments, did you find raising the projector made the print smaller or larger?

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Robert Howle
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Printing troubles

Post#80 » Wed Oct 15, 2014 3:21 pm

I am trying to help you. I was using 10 sec and 2.5 sec with 1:1 mix on my 1.1 machine. U really should try these settings for subsequent layers. Also suggest u go back to 1.000 on the MSM. I printed for over a year using these settings. U can back up from these if your prints are to thick.

Robert
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