B9R-1-Red Design Rules

A lost wax capable resin tuned for 70 - 200 micron slice thickness
Rabs1
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#1 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:28 pm

I've been doing some (moderately) scientific tests to put the B9 through its paces.

These include tests on minimum wall thickness, minimum feature size, maximum overhang and so on.

From these I've started to put together a set of design rules.

All tests were printed with the settings in the image below.
Image

The test results are here:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/r1ypanfxkr26x6o/Design%20rules.xlsx

Traffic light colours indicate good, moderate and failed printing.




The .stl, .b9l and .b9j files for all my test pieces are here:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/6xqnpc3x5gu6opr/2Qxy-4uCup


I'll post some photos shortly of the results.

My setup was as well calibrated and levelled as I could manage. At the moment I have no evidence to say if the results I got are the fundamental limitations of the B9, or simply the limitation of my setup. For this reason it would be great if a couple of other people could repeat these tests with the same .b9j file.

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mikej
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#2 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:46 pm

Nice work! I look forward to the photos too.
Measure Twice, Cut Once.

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tim.yoshi
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#3 » Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:22 pm

Awesome test, very informative and handy.
Image

nick
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#4 » Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:44 am

Wow! Great work!

Your cure settings seem high for 50XY. Have you tried lower cure times? Are others using as high of cure times? I've been using more like 7s/4s at 50XY, but haven't spent a ton of time at the resolution yet.

Next steps:
-duplicate these experiments
-process DOE
-refined design study with resultant process from above DOE

I can help with the DOE. We will need many duplications to cover all XY resolutions and layer thicknesses, but then we should have a fully developed cure matrix for every set up.

nick
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#5 » Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:44 am

Wow! Great work!

Your cure settings seem high for 50XY. Have you tried lower cure times? Are others using as high of cure times? I've been using more like 7s/4s at 50XY, but haven't spent a ton of time at the resolution yet.

Next steps:
-duplicate these experiments
-process DOE
-refined design study with resultant process from above DOE

I can help with the DOE. We will need many duplications to cover all XY resolutions and layer thicknesses, but then we should have a fully developed cure matrix for every set up.

Rabs1
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#6 » Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:57 am

That's what I'm hoping for. I deliberately left the cure times at Mike's defaults for 50umXY and 50.8um Z so that we have a benchmark to work from. Also, I reasoned that these will give a higher probability of successful printing and less chance of bits coming off than lower cure times.

Longer term I want to repeat these experiments with thinner slices and shorter cure times. Also I am finding that parts are coming out a little oversize (to be expected with conservative cure times) by between 50 and 100um.

However, I'm going to wait until at least a couple of people have done the same test just to check that we're roughly in the same place to start. There's not much point spending days optimising my setup if I've missed something big that means that the results aren't useful for others. Better to get a feel for the consistency between machines first.

himanshu
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#7 » Thu Jan 10, 2013 12:03 pm

I am using B9 Red Resin with Galvo Based System(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Vu_agjDWKg) for Jewellary Printing. And comparing Results with DWSSystems Resin. I Will post pictures and Data in 2-3 days.
So far Results are Good. But i want to go up to 30-40 micron in XY and 25 micron in Z.I notice that base layers(Slow Galvo Speed) dont give me Sharp Result in XY. Even Z is thicker. I can manage it using Laser Speed and Laser Power(Not Reliable Option). i want to manage is chemically. I am planning to use SUDAN I to control Layer thickness. Need suggestions from mike. I read from nano CEMMS paper that Sudan I can control Layer thickness Will Sudan I help in XY ??

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mikej
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#8 » Thu Jan 10, 2013 7:25 pm

I'm unfamiliar with Sudan, but if it only blocks UV, not blue light, it will have minimal effect in controlling depth of cure.
Measure Twice, Cut Once.

Metagamer
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#9 » Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:09 pm

Quote from Rabs1 on January 10, 2013, 08:57
That's what I'm hoping for. I deliberately left the cure times at Mike's defaults for 50umXY and 50.8um Z so that we have a benchmark to work from. [...]

Longer term I want to repeat these experiments with thinner slices and shorter cure times. Also I am finding that parts are coming out a little oversize (to be expected with conservative cure times) by between 50 and 100um.


I just found this thread, and it looks like you've got similar interests to my own. Mike recently recommended that the B9-R1-Red resin is optimal only for 75-100um Z slices, so that could be contributing to oversized parts. I'll give this model a try soon and let you know how it goes.

garydawson
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#10 » Sat Mar 30, 2013 1:09 pm

This is really great work, thank you for adding it and sharing the files.

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Eddie J
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#11 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:33 am

With regards to the pigment in the resin - is there anything spesific about the US composites red pigment which the B9 resin requires in it? Or would any red or yellow pigment for resin be suitable for blocking the light? I have other flavours of resin pigments already :D

Im not sure how far off the B9 grey resin is? is it worth me buying some gear to mix and test some higher pigment resin for 25um printing, or sitting tight and waiting a little while for the official B9 grey stuff? :S

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mikej
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#12 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:48 am

Nothing special about the US composites pigment, just needs to absorb the correct amount of blue to near UV light to limit the depth of cure. I suppose it's possible that some pigments will mix better with the resin than others.

I expect to have be offering the 25-50 micron tuned resin by the first of May.
Measure Twice, Cut Once.

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Eddie J
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B9R-1-Red Design Rules

Post#13 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 7:53 pm

Fantastic Mike, really looking forward to getting some of that. Ill sit tight and wait for release :D

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