WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

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graham
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WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#1 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:28 am

So a while ago I decided I was going to design and make my girlfriend an engagement ring from scratch. I'd never dealt with 3D software or anything before but I spent the last 3 months learning and designing.
I've accumulated a diamond, centrifugal caster, kiln, and a completed 3D design. Now I just need a B9 to get the process moving.
I dont have the money right now to buy a new one (spent it all on the diamond) so I'm hoping I can find a good used one for a good price.
Thanks in advance!!

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panastation
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#2 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:40 am

good luck
U wont regret buying 1.2... many people sell brand new b9 because they dont take the time to understand how the parts work. also they buy the kit and mail people throw those boxes around.
anything less than 300 lamp hours is like new....best printer out there for the price

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akgold
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#3 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 1:05 pm

graham wrote:So a while ago I decided I was going to design and make my girlfriend an engagement ring from scratch. I'd never dealt with 3D software or anything before but I spent the last 3 months learning and designing.
I've accumulated a diamond, centrifugal caster, kiln, and a completed 3D design. Now I just need a B9 to get the process moving.
I dont have the money right now to buy a new one (spent it all on the diamond) so I'm hoping I can find a good used one for a good price.
Thanks in advance!!


Wow now that is going beyond the norm for sure. I don't know of anyone who decided to get engaged and then spend money on a diamond, and then spend the last 3 months learning and designing after buying 3d software, a centrifugal caster, and a kiln to make it yourself. She is a lucky gal.
So just the cost of the printer would most likely equal or exceed the amount it would cost you to have had just the design grown cast and finished providing there is no other diamonds added to it.
Otherwise your going to have to learn how to set the diamonds so your going to need a foredom hand piece and motor plus the correct burs needed to set the diamonds.
Then you will need a polisher and polishing wheels Rouge and tripoli/bobbing compounds, files sand paper, etc etc.

unless your planning on continuing this as a career I would suggest you just pay someone here a 100 bucks or what ever they charge to grow the model for you and put the printer on the back burner till you get the money.
There are some 1.1 and 1.2HD models out there for between 1500 to 2700 but then again they are used and the hours on the lamps are or can become an issue for printing.
Oh by the way you will need a vacuum machine or table and bell jar to invest the model and you will need investment to invest it.

I would have imagined if you sent one of us the model we could have grown and cast it for less than150 to 200 depending on if it is clipped and shipped or cast and finished plus the cost of gold.
I'm so far behind I think I'm First !!

graham
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#4 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 3:39 pm

RE:PANASTATION

Thanks for the advice!
I'm curious about the v1.2 I know it is faster and can print more detail, but if I'm not too worried about speed it looks like from these posts from CarterTG and the date of them he was using the v1.1 and the detail is great!

viewtopic.php?t=235

RE:AKGOLD

Thanks for the response
I definitely thought about going that route, but I really wanted the ring to be 'hand made'.
I am for sure going to get the diamond professionally set, I can recast the ring but I won't risk chipping the diamond.
I also know there are a few more supplies/tools etc I'll need but this is the biggest/most expensive!

I expect that since I am new at this that I will need to practice the casting many times on zinc and so would need a bunch printed as well as I expect once I try casting that changes may need to be made to the design.
Also if this ok goes well I will do our wedding bands as well. (It will be nice to not work in secret any more haha)
All of this plays into why I want to get the printer instead of sending away for a few prints.

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akgold
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#5 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 7:32 pm

zinc??
Why would you cast with zinc it has no properties and no comparison what so ever to cast in gold or silver

if your going to experiment just find an online seller of wax ring patterns and use them to set up and cast in silver
silver casting grain is cheap or buy some scrap silver jewelry
but zinc would be a big mistake.
There are other metals you can use like bronze or just use alloy but not zinc. it will not go well.
I'm so far behind I think I'm First !!

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Metalcaster
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#6 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 7:35 pm

You would be better off to practice casting Jewelers bronze instead of zinc...
The temperature ranges for gold and bronze are much closer and working on bronze will also be more similar to gold then Zinc.

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Metalcaster
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#7 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 7:40 pm

Silver as AK says is good too and the temperature for silver is closer to gold then bronze. for Bronze casting, you need to hit around 2000 oF or just below... that is at the limit of the better hand held electric melters

For a beginner, the hand held Italian melters available from Gesswein are great and pretty accurate...
My preference is torch casting and it is a lot less costly to use Propane/ oxygen. I would not suggest you start with a torch unless you have a background using one.
Good luck. Plenty of us that offer free advice.

graham
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#8 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 7:57 pm

Wow thanks for all the advice.
I had heard that zinc was a good practice metal, but perhaps that was incorrect.
In Canada our pennies are made of zinc so I was just going to melt a bunch of those down haha.
I will look into bronze and silver etc.
I plan on making the rings out of platinum.
I am fully aware that this is the most difficult and requires very high temps as well as specific investment and crucible.
Like I said, lots of practice needed is expected.

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panastation
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#9 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:02 pm

Good luck...
so u are looking for a 1.1 machine....still that will not come cheap :arrow: + resin+replacement lamp for sure..plus sale price
It all sounds pretty until u get to the part that u want to cast in plat..
Not joking--- do u plan to have the ring ready anytime by april next year.
You are trying to do 2 many things and on top of that u have to come out with a finished plat diamond ring that she will like.

Give it a shot...my father always said people learn the hard way............

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Robert Howle
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#10 » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:47 pm

A standard casting machine, if the centrifugal type, wont' work. You have to have a vertical machine. You could just invest in a 25k machine that will cast all metals.

I have been a custom jeweler for almost 40 yrs. and I still don't cast my own platinum. I do cast all the other common precious metals. You are looking at this project the wrong way. Model it, print it, then use one of the many service providers for the casting like thousands of small jewelers do. Then there is the finishing, plat is the most difficut to get high polished finish. Then there is the hrs and hrs of setting experience u need to be able to set a diamond, and God help u if it's a princess cut, because u will break it.

So i say, design, print, let someone else cast and finish and set the stone. U will have done the part that she might care about, the design.

As said above,
Good luck.

Robert Howle
Dance like nobody's watching!

graham
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#11 » Thu Apr 21, 2016 6:57 am

Thanks Robert, as mentioned above I don't plan on setting the stone myself, I don't want to risk chipping or cracking it. Also it is a round cut

I am curious in all my research (and as you can imagine there has been hours and hours and hours of it) I have never come across a vertical centrifugal caster being a prerequisite for platinum. What is the reason for this.
Thanks for sharing your wealth of experience and knowledge!

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Robert Howle
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#12 » Thu Apr 21, 2016 12:32 pm

HIgh temp and cooling require the metal to inter the flask under pressure and very quickly. Just google vertical casting machine.
Dance like nobody's watching!

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RobertW
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#13 » Thu Apr 21, 2016 1:28 pm

The vertical centrifugal casting machine is required because it delivers the force needed to completely fill the casting cavity before the platinum begins to solidify. A matter of milliseconds. Self-taught DIY platinum casting? Forget it. The technique required to properly cast platinum requires skills, materials and equipment far above and beyond those required to cast other precious metals. Very quick reflexes and hand/eye coordination is a must. Sprueing models and envesting flasks is all different. On the job training is absolutely essential (read: you can't learn how from a youtube video) and I know of no professional who would train someone who has no casting experience whatsoever.

Yours is a romantic notion. But impractical and misguided. It's like wanting to fly her to Maui for your honeymoon so you decide to make it more personal by learning how to fly and build the plane yourself. A smart man would make her feel like a queen and pamper her with a nice first class ticket or, better yet, charter her a private jet.

I, for one, am curious to see screen shots of the engagement ring you created after those long months (not years) it took to learn jewelry design and 3d modeling. If you post it here or on another forum, you might receive some helpful critique on your design to improve it.

At the very least have it cast in platinum by a professional. I can recommend one if you ask.

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akgold
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#14 » Thu Apr 21, 2016 5:22 pm

graham wrote:Thanks Robert, as mentioned above I don't plan on setting the stone myself, I don't want to risk chipping or cracking it. Also it is a round cut

I am curious in all my research (and as you can imagine there has been hours and hours and hours of it) I have never come across a vertical centrifugal caster being a prerequisite for platinum. What is the reason for this.
Thanks for sharing your wealth of experience and knowledge!


You can be book smart ( research didn't say anything about vertical casting machine ) or you can be smart to listen to experienced mentors, Watch and learn or do and learn from your mistakes.
I have been casting gold and silver, very little bronze, for over 30yrs. I was involved in doing a platinum casting up at the Univ. metals dept.back in the early 80's ( the only place in Fairbanks that had a platinum caster) and it was a total failure the firs time. It took us 3times to get it right. After that we left them to it as we were the ones they asked about how to do it. Even though we were casting ourselves it was a learning experience for us too. we were using acetylene/oxy Big mistake platinum obsorbs carbon which caused our failures. the we used Hydrogen torch after we found out it would do the trick
by the way platinum (depending on the mix) has a casting temp of just under 3200 deg. F.
as it turns out we should have used Hydrogen all along.

What I learned from it was to send all my platinum casting projects out to a casting house. At the time it was common knowledge that platinum castings then had a 50% failure rate unless you were using inert gas atmosphere vacuum casting machine with enclosed induction melting. then there was a factor of 20% failure rates. But in the 80's we just didn't have that many choices in casting houses like we do now.

The temperatures used in casting platinum are high end. and the investment is really hard.
you have to use Highly corrosive acids to divest the investment to get the cast piece.
I don't know where you did your research but a quick google brought this up along with tons of other info sites
http://www.platinumguild.com/files/pdf/ ... g_tech.pdf
I'm so far behind I think I'm First !!

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panastation
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#15 » Thu Apr 21, 2016 5:46 pm

well i dont want to bring down the romantic idea you had... A used 1.1 b9 can still print much better than many of the more expensive printers out there at the 3-5k range.
To cast it you wont need a vertical caster you can buy one of these minis..http://www.gesswein.com/p-9034-ti-research-castt-machine.aspx
If you plan to live making jewlery or manufacturing :arrow: --go for it. But its alot of equipment u have never used.
..ON the other hand if its just gona be one time thing :arrow:
Send your 3d model off to casting house-or- ask the gentlemen on this forum if they can do it for you.

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perpetual_dreamer
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Re: WANTED-B9 Victoria Canada

Post#16 » Fri Apr 22, 2016 6:37 am

You're investing a lot of money if you only plan on making one ring. If I were you, I'd send it off to a caster and stone setting, but do everything else myself. Otherwise, the 1.1 version is just as good as the 1.2 b9 version. It just requires a little more effort to have it calibrated perfectly. However, with the ball bearing upgrades etc, it is easy peasy. Good luck.

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